The power of mindsets and mindfulness with Rizwan Javaid

Nirish Shakya: [00:00:00] Welcome back to The Design Feeling Podcast, and a special welcome to season four. I'm your host Nearish Shaya, and I'm super excited to have you join us on this new journey and to celebrate the launch of season four, our friends over at the UX Conference have offered a 10% discount to their UX design conference, the UX Con, on the 13th of September at the iconic South Bank Center in London. It's a no waffle, no slides conference where you'll experience live demos of UX and UI tools. You'll have design quizzes and even a designer versus AI battlefield and they've lined up some really diverse speakers from top companies like Eurostar, TripAdvisor, and HubSpot. So it's definitely an event you don't wanna miss. you can use the discount code DESIGNFEELINGPODCAST10, all one word. At theuxconf.com to claim your 10% off, That's [00:01:00] DESIGNFEELINGPODCAST10 and that's not all. We're also giving away a remote ticket to the UX conf worth 114 pounds. I. To enter. All you have to do is subscribe to this podcast wherever you listen to podcasts and just send me an email at nirish@designfeeling.co saying, Hey, I've subscribed and I wanna win the ticket and you'll have to do this by Wednesday, the 9th of August. So we can announce the winner on Thursday, the 10th of August, and if you already subscribed and you still wanna win a ticket, just send me an email anyway.

Okay. So looking back, season three was a treasure trove of insights. We kicked off with I X D A President Andy mlo, exploring the concept of self-awareness, which is a pretty big topic on this podcast. And throughout the season we navigated quite a few diverse range of topics from creativity and ventures to bootcamps and parenthood, topics you probably wouldn't [00:02:00] hear in other design or UX podcasts, one of our most popular episodes featured Nina McNamara discussing the UX of sex. Yes, you heard that, right? It's exactly what it said on the tin. It's definitely a must Listen if you haven't already. 

So after I wrapped up season three, I took a bit of a break and flew to the States to reconnect with some old friends and family, something that I was desperately craving, especially after months of intense work and teaching. I. And some of you might know that I took on the role of a course director at the Berg School of Communication in Stockholm earlier this year, and I taught my first semester of UX and product design there.

And at the same time, I completed my coaching certification as well. And all these things were a lot of fun, but by the end of it, I was just exhausted. And I was recently reading a book called 10 X is Easier. [00:03:00] Two X by Dan Sullivan and Benjamin Hardy. And in that book they talk about how athletes and entertainers they operate in these three distinct boats, preparation, performance, and recovery.

And that made me realize how quite often us designers, we tend to ignore the recovery part of the cycle and go straight into preparing for the next project. But this time I deliberately built in that recovery time and now I'm back with fuller batteries.

And as we embark on season four, you can look forward to more thought provoking conversations on self-awareness and creative confidence and meaning from experts from across the globe. For the first three episodes, I've actually lined up experts for you from three different continents.

And to start us off, I'm delighted to welcome Wan Javid. Rizwan is a human-centered designer from San Francisco with over a [00:04:00] decade of experience in the industry. Even with all that experience, wan grappled with fear and doubt and imposter syndrome for a long time in his career. In our first episode, he will share his journey of overcoming the struggles through the power of mindsets. Journey. He also chronicles in his newsletter, low Fidelity and Podcast Unleash Your Mindset. So here's a sneak peek of this episode. It all starts with the mind.

Shivaun: This is the Design Feeling Podcast with your host Nirish Shakya. 

Nirish Shakya: Hello. My name is Nirish Shakya and I'm a human-centered designer, educator and coach. And this is a podcast for well, human-centered designers and innovators and problem solvers who tend to forget the human within the. The conversations you'll hear [00:05:00] will help you increase your self-awareness and creative confidence so that you can make the impact that gives you the joy and meaning that you seek.

Let's get started. 

So Rizwan, imagine that they made a movie out of your life. tell me where would that movie start? What would be the first scene of the movie?

Rizwan Javaid: I think the first scene of my movie would be, around the. I guess the.com era, cause that's when I started with design. Yeah. Yeah. I was actually, working in a restaurant waiting tables and a cousin, a cousin of mine, he wanted to start a design agency and at that time everybody was starting design agencies.

So he called me up and I was in, Fort Lauderdale and I jumped on the chance, [00:06:00] moved out to Dallas, and after that it was just, in the design field and just learning on the job, going from one, one startup to the next. And, And of course, from one layoff to the next as well.

So there was a lot of experience, I gained at that time, but I started off with, with web design, but then, But then after, a few years realized that UX was the thing, so then moved out to, California and, joined a UX agency here and, and then learned on the job there as well. So that would be, I would say, the opening scene.

And, I feel like, I'm still in the opening scene. There's a

started even, I'm. To the point where things are clicking, things are happening. I understand, design, I understand how things [00:07:00] together and showing up and leaning, way before it was a bit of challenge.

Nirish Shakya: How What? What did you mean? Things that start to. Click more and before was this challenge.

Rizwan Javaid: yeah. I, I went through a lot of inner struggles, just, just a few years ago and. I was, I just wasn't sure of myself and the skills I had. And so I had a lot of doubt, just swirling in my head. And when I joined the agency here in California, I was more, I was very quiet. I was, on the sidelines.

I was just there. A lot of imposter syndrome.

It was just, I just wasn't sure of myself, so I wasn't sharing my ideas. I was, there was a lot of struggle going on and that caused me to like, like it really affected my work as well and my [00:08:00] performance. And so then, getting a wake up call once and then, realizing that I needed to change things up, can't keep, going like that,

Nirish Shakya: Risan, you mentioned a wake up call. What, what, what, what did this wake up call look like?

Rizwan Javaid: So the wake up call was, it's usually like having a talk with your manager of how your performance is going, and sometimes you need that external, voice to tell you, how, how you're doing. Because in, in your mind, you can be doing great, but externally the story could be something different.

Nirish Shakya: What? What do they say?

Rizwan Javaid: Up or out. So I was basically it. so

Nirish Shakya: we've all had one of those, one-to-ones with our managers, sometime in our career.

Rizwan Javaid: yeah,

coasting along and thinking fine, but. But other people see the, the things that you don't see. So it's good to [00:09:00]have that external feedback as well. Whether it's a wake up call, whether it's like,just a friendly chat with your friend. feedback is like to say a gift.

Nirish Shakya: And so whether it's easy to take or hard to take, it's still, something that needs to be considered. And how did you feel when you heard those words?

Rizwan Javaid: it's, it's tough, when you hear that, you're not living up to,your potential or your standards and, and, and having gone through, layoffs and, multiple layoffs in the past, it's a challenge.

But there's also, after. You calm down and you look at it, from a little bit of distance,there you realize that, you know there is truth to it, or you see the opportunity in that feedback and then you can adjust. And so I adjusted, and I picked up on the things that I needed to.

Nirish Shakya: And [00:10:00] so for example, public speaking, That was a big challenge for me. even standing up in front of my team was a challenge and speaking to them, crowd. so then I started practicing going. Delivering talks at meetups and then conferences. And so I was able to take something that was weakness and make it So the, the feedback was that, you had to get better at pub public speaking and, and speaking up.

I speaking up and,participating. And then at that time I was. I just, I was also learning, the power of sketching as a designer. I had just, hadn't, hadn't picked it up along the way. Cause I had learned on my own,learned design on my own. So I, I just didn't see the value in sketching and it like sketching with your hand or using sketch?

Rizwan Javaid: using sketching for, for your, in your design process. sharing your ideas [00:11:00] with a quick sketch instead of going straight to the computer and designing. Yeah, exactly. So that's, that was a big challenge as well. And that was one of the feedback, feedback, I received from manager is to, Share ideas that are more, more thought out, more stronger.

And so I kind combined both the sketching and public speaking together. And so I was able to practice those, with the team, with meetups and then conferences. slowly but shortly I was able to get better at both.

Nirish Shakya: Mm. And. How did you take that step to, first of all, accept the feedback and then action it? Because, a lot of times, when I have heard feedback either, I tend to reject it sometimes of like, oh, I don't, I don't, I don't agree with it. Or even if you accept it, you are like, I don't need to be good at that.

I've, I've got other, my, my own unique strengths, why do I need [00:12:00] to be good at everything? How did you recognize that that's something that you need to be good at?

Rizwan Javaid: I think it, it was just looking at the, my, the, my coworkers. And for example, when you're in a, in a meeting, a design meeting, and you see your team members just. Without hesitation going up to the board and sketching something on the board, sh sketching their ideas and they're confident, you can see that confidence, and that's what I wanted to get, is to have that confidence to share my ideas and not just, negate them or hold them back because I can't express them.

And so I didn't have that confidence. So's I knew I wanted to get to that point.

Nirish Shakya: Mm.

Rizwan Javaid: So then just realizing I need to learn more about sketching, practice it, and, overcome that hesitation.

Nirish Shakya: Yeah, I, I can definitely relate to this cuz when I was also [00:13:00] starting out in my career, and this was like almost 13 or 14 years ago now, and we used to have our morning standups with the team. And, in the, in, in, in, in the afternoon, I had a one-to-one with my boss. And my boss noticed something that I had done during the standup when I was kicking my updates and he was like, nih, why did you stop breathing? Right, because apparently I was just like, going through my train of thought and I just forgot to breathe and you could see that I was being nervous, giving that update, even if it's like a very tiny team update. and I, I did stop breathing at that point, and that that's something that I hadn't noticed myself.

And when he gave me that feedback, I kind of felt bad. I was like, oh, maybe, I'm not good enough. there's something wrong with me. But it's like you said, it was only when I create that space between me and, and the feedback that actually, actually see it, from a neutral [00:14:00] point of view and actually action it.

And, and just like you, at the same time, I was actually, I went through a lot of public speaking training as well, which really helped me with my own design communication.

Rizwan Javaid: Nice. Yeah. It's that space to look at, look at the areas we need to improve. just taking action on them, however small. And, one tool that I've been using lately is morning pages. I dunno if you've ever tried that or journaling.

Nirish Shakya: Absolutely. I love that. Yeah.

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah. And, and morning pages, for me is an opportunity to reflect back on what happened the previous day or the day before, and.

And to see, how to, to create the space, to look at it, examine it, and, and even come up with a plan for the next time. I mean, that situation, I have a better understanding of why I, I do certain things and how I can [00:15:00] improve for next time. So it, it helps me, understand what happened and then, Create a plan for next time I'm ready instead of going same experiences over and over again.

Nirish Shakya: Mm. You can like identify the patterns, the recovering patterns,

Rizwan Javaid: And

Nirish Shakya: and in, and like.

Rizwan Javaid: yeah, exactly. just yesterday I was out at a community, lunch and. All of a sudden my, I realized that my social anxiety was kicking in and, and I, I kinda fell into it and the whole experience was, wasn't that great. And I was kind of, I was wondering, why, why did that happen?

Even though I felt like I was in a good. Place with my social anxiety. But this morning I was able to just, write down what I saw, what I thought, and then come up with a plan for next time [00:16:00] it'll happen. And so now I feel better that I won't just, fall with the fall into my thoughts the next time it happens.

Nirish Shakya: Mm. Yeah, I, I love that. And I've, I've had similar experiences as well where it kind of, It empowers you to do something about it rather than just, accept it as something that's wrong with you. A lot of times it's not something that's wrong with you, it's just these habits that, you've, you've picked up or the conditioning that you know that you've been through.

And a lot of, the lot of the time, these are things that are external to you that they don't actually define you. But a lot of times we tend to, define ourselves or accept that our as our identity. Oh yeah, I can't, talk in public or I can't do this or I can't sketch. A lot of times these are all external, entities that can be changed.

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah, exactly. And it's just having that awareness that, and maybe it's, maybe it's the awareness that the morning pages allows you to.[00:17:00]

Help you get out of that automatic, behavior that has been, that you've been doing for so long. yeah.

Nirish Shakya: Yeah, absolutely. and then you went on to, Start your newsletter, lo Fidelity, and then, your podcast as well. unleash your mindset. tell us, tell us about that journey that took you to starting these, new initiatives.

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah,low fidelity started as a result of me overcoming some of the inner struggles that I was experiencing. And so I had a lot of, imposter syndrome doubt. And fear comparison, almost everything

shape or form. Realized that I couldn't keep going like that. So I worked with a coach to who helped me, bring that [00:18:00] external voice and, and see how I was doing things holding back. And so I, I made a lot of progress, through that, coaching. And I realized that, life is too short for us to be.

Held back by our inner struggles, as, as designers we're our head. But then, that's a good thing. But then it can also become a challenge that can hold us back and to know that there's a way past those struggles instead of thinking this is our reality and this is all, all there is. So I want to help.

Others who other, others who are, who may be experiencing similar challenges. And so that's why I started low fidelity, is to just write about my experiences and things that I have gone through related to these, struggles. that we all experience because these, these are human experiences, so [00:19:00] chances are if I'm experiencing them, other people are also experiencing them.

So with that thought, I started low fidelity just writing, and then started a podcast to, to spread the message even more

Are. And how they're dealing with it to learn from their, their experience as well. yeah, so it all journey to, to learn more about how to tackle our inner challenges.

Nirish Shakya: Yeah, and I can tell from experience that, starting a podcast or starting a new newsletter, putting your voice out there, it does take a lot of guts. It does takes a lot of courage because, we, again, the imposter syndrome comes in, right? Like who would wanna listen to what you have to say?

How did you get over that?

Rizwan Javaid: it's been a, it's been a bumpy ride. I dunno if I'm over it.

Nirish Shakya: It's constant struggle.

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah, [00:20:00] yeah. Cause it's, there's, there's ups and downs. there were a lot of and downs when I started, I was focusing on the wrong thing. So if I didn't get a lot of likes, Then I would say, oh no, I would think in my mind, oh, nobody cares about what I'm saying, so why even do it?

Nirish Shakya: it's all by the metrics, isn't it?

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah. Yeah. And that's, it's a challenge even till now.

But I think it's, it's become better because,even now my focus is, Sharing my message or sharing my insights or sharing, my experiences instead of how, what the metrics are saying. So it's more about getting things off my chest and then,people, people, liking my content.

So it's, so changing, changing my mindset there has helped to continue and keep consistent with the writing, the newsletter. the [00:21:00] podcast I kind of fell off, but,with this podcast I'm getting back into it. And But it, it's, it's, it's a learning process and I think the next time I'll come out stronger and it'll be, it'll continue until some other challenge comes up.

So I think the challenges are gonna be there no matter what. They're just gonna change, take different forms. But I think it's just developing the, the resiliency, along the way so that they don't, those challenges don't throw you off track. At least that's my hope is.

Nirish Shakya: Yeah. And Risan you are, you are pretty big on mindsets. tell us, tell us more about how did you get into exploring mindsets as a designer?

Rizwan Javaid: So as, I was, working with my coach, I real, I realized that the mindsets, my mindset is what was bringing a lot of challenges. for [00:22:00] example,I, when I would try something, something, and then if it didn't work out, I would stop. I would quit. like for example, a simple example is baking bread.

If I didn't, I would, I would try to make bread and usually I did. I completely,was bad at it or didn't turn out good at all. Then I would really beat myself up and not try it again. I would think, this is, I'm just not good enough. bread is not just not for me, but.

Nirish Shakya: That's why I've never even tried it.

Rizwan Javaid: No, it's, it's,so yeah, so the, the mindset I changed to was the developing an experimentation mindset. So instead of going in and saying, okay, it's either gonna be good or bad, and that's it. this taking. It, approaching it as an experimentation. So I'm going to try this recipe [00:23:00] and if it works, I'm gonna, it, it's good and I can see what I can improve for next time.

Or if it doesn't turn out good, I can see what I did wrong and then improve for next time. And so that simple mindset shift has helped me. Get better at making bread, of course. And then also in, in life in general. in projects, in my design work, if something that I've tried doesn't work, then not beating myself up about it.

Not saying I'm not a good designer and I'm not gonna. I'm, just going down that path, I'm going to see what happened, what did I do that didn't help me, and then adjust for next time. And so that mindset shift ha, has helped me, tremendously. And there's others like,the growth mindset and to, and also an abundance mindset.

So instead of thinking that there's only [00:24:00] a limited amount of opportunities, Out in the world for, for me, there, there's an abundance of opportunities. So I can, I don't have to compete with others. I just have to, bring my ideas, my thoughts out and not worry about, not worry about, any limited opportunities.

Cause things will, will happen. I just need to do what I need to do.

Nirish Shakya: Mm. Yeah. Yeah. I totally agree in terms of the, the power of mindset. Cause a lot of times the mindset is the challenge. In terms of how youth, how we think about a challenge itself is a challenge. and I'm sure like a lot of people who are listening right now, they, they are aware of the, again, the value of ma mindsets.

but something that's, a person I struggle with is in terms of how do I apply that knowledge of mindset on a, at a daily level, at a practical level. could you give us an example of how mindsets, how you [00:25:00] intentionally, apply the right mindset? In the right scenario, in, in your design process, for example.

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah. go. Going back to the, beginner's mind, well, going back to the mindset, beginner's mindset is one of those that, I feel like I need to, bring every day to my work. So instead of, When, faced with a challenge or some problem that I need to work on,

Listen to,I can open up and listen to what the team is saying and what their experiences are and take all that in and learn from their experience. And then share what the thoughts that I have instead of leading with,I'm the design, I'm the designer and this is the way things are.

And simple change in mindset like that can help. Help you take in more knowledge, learn and then, adjust course. Cause I'm not, [00:26:00] I'm not gonna be right. all the time. and this is, and I'm working with the team. taking all that in, having a beginner's mindset is really crucial.

So it's those opportunities, throughout the day that come up. to, to apply different types of mindsets. I think that's the key.

Nirish Shakya: Mm. Yeah. Yeah. I think, I remember when you, I was starting out in my career, I always used to, pretend to be an expert like I thought, clients. they, they were hiring me to have the right answers. I'm meant to be the expert, so I shouldn't be asking questions. I should just have the right answers.

And, it was like kind of that, I guess another mindset of, faking Italy, make it. and that kind of, to me conflicts with some of the, the concepts around the beginner's mindset in terms of like, not knowing the right answer and being okay with it. having maybe going in more with, with the right questions. I guess, and, and a lot of this also plays into our own [00:27:00] imposter syndrome and our own kind of, I guess, self-inflicted inadequacies of who we are and that, and that kind makes it more difficult to adopt a lot of these mindsets in practice, I'm assuming.

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah. yeah, I think,I think you know, just how loud the voice is in your head that the inner critic is in your head and telling you, no, no, no, just how how much we listen to that voice can affect how we. Can shift into a better mindset. So I think, one tool to use, that, that has really worked for me is meditation.

And, just taking even 10 minutes, in the morning to to realize that, the thoughts that we have are not who we are. And, and to stop identifying with the thoughts and to create that space. which is similar to the morning pages, is creating space between the thoughts and our actions, [00:28:00] thoughts and our reactions and, and, and meditation is another tool to, create that space and then, then have the awareness to.

Shift into a better mindset that you, would be more helpful. And so it takes some practice, but,that's a great way to not let your, fears and doubts just overcome you in this, in a situation.

Nirish Shakya: Yeah. What does that look, what does that workflow look like, on a day-to-day basis for you in terms of like using your, mindfulness practice to adopt a certain mindset?

Rizwan Javaid: so it, it can be, first thing in the morning or it can be when, you know that, when I know that I'm going to be overcome with anxiety. Anxiety. So it could be before a big presentation. I can, I can.[00:29:00] do some breathing exercises, right before it to calm myself down, or any other big event that I know that my anxiety is gonna take over.

And it can, it only takes just, a few minutes and you can kind of, relax and get back into your own self instead of being overcome with, worry and doubt. So it, it happens throughout the day. all different situations come up and it's hard to plan of course, so things come at you from all different directions.

But having these tools such as,such as breathing exercises, mindful, meditation, journaling, or morning pages, all those are tools that you can use whenever, whenever you need throughout.

Nirish Shakya: Mm. But then when you're caught up in the moment, how do you remember to use the tool?

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah, that's,I think that comes with practice. And for example, just [00:30:00] like I said yesterday, I, I, I gave into my anxious thoughts, with, social, anxiety and. And I wasn't able to apply what, what I knew or, these tools and the breathing exercises, it just completely vanished.

And, so now, but I was able to think back and reflect on it. And now, next time, I know I will be able to remember to do some breathing exercises. And there's, you're gonna fail. You're gonna, you can keep trying and, eventually you will, start to build those behaviors and habits to, to use those tools when you need.

Nirish Shakya: Hmm. And. How has this impacted your actual, outputs as a designer?

Rizwan Javaid: For me, I'm actually, just even though I've been in. in the design field for a long [00:31:00] time, I feel like I'm just getting started because now I, I don't have those worries, those doubts that I used to have. And now I can focus on the work that I, that I need to do or am doing. And The voice, the inner critic and the voices, the thoughts, they, they still happen, but they're not controlling, my output or controlling, me, as much.

So Im able to have more fun, in at work. And lean in and show up like I want. Cause before I, I knew I had a different image of myself than what was showing up. And so I feel like now there's a, a balance between what I'm think and how I'm showing up. So there's, there's no, disconnect there. Where before it was, there was a lot of disconnect and so I think that caused a.

Nirish Shakya: Mm.

Rizwan Javaid: [00:32:00] the, my journey, the coaching and the learning and focusing on the mindsets,has helped me get to this point. And now it's,now I'm having fun and it's, I feel like I'm just getting started.

Nirish Shakya: Mm. So before, how were you thinking and how were you showing up and how were they two different.

Rizwan Javaid: So before it was in my mind I thought I, cause I had, I had been in the industry for so long and like I, certain amount of experience, I was at this level when I. When I hadn't, proven to myself that I could do it, it was more of maybe it was feeling, it was more of an entitlement and, the world owes me.

And, there were all these loud voices in my head that, caused me to think a certain way. And [00:33:00] now when those voices or those thoughts, Don't take over. don't, don't take over me. I can, I'm having more, more fun, but I dunno if that answers your question.

Nirish Shakya: Mm. Yeah. Yeah. So you're kind of like boring in the state of flow rather than force where you're not constantly trying to swim upstream against who you really are inside.

Rizwan Javaid: exactly. Yeah, I think that's a great way to put it.

I'm going with the, with the, with the flow of the water instead of against it. And that struggle isn't there. And when you don't have that struggle, it's it fee, you feel so light and you feel like you can breathe and you can show up. And I think that's the essence that I'm trying to get to with low fidelity.

Nirish Shakya: Yeah. so if you could give any advice to the R one that was going through this, these [00:34:00]struggles in the past, what's the top, the number one advice would you give that person?

Rizwan Javaid: I would, I would give them the tools to manage their, their thoughts. I think it's, The, the mindfulness and meditation,the, the techniques to give them, the tools to be able to, work through those struggles instead of just thinking that this is how they are, this is, there, there's something wrong with you, or there's some, you just not cut out for design career or any career.

I, I would say, To, to ha to understand these tools, understand mindset, and that there is,there is a path forward. And so I think understanding that, you can get help and you, you can move past those struggles. I think that's a big,big learning that I didn't have before.[00:35:00]

Nirish Shakya: Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And what was. Thing that helped you the most in this journey of discovery yourself? Like was there a particular resource, a person, or some kind of, I dunno, book?

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah, I, I think for me it was the coaching. I had tried to overcome, this, the doubt, the imposter syndrome on my own, but it just wasn't working. And sometimes you need that external voice to check your internal voice, so you need that. Check there and however you get it, whether it's a mentor or a friend or coach, it's, I think it's important to have that external voice so that they can let you know what they see, what you think, and what others see.

Maybe two different things. And so having that, That check there is, is [00:36:00] critical and getting somebody's help to overcome your inner struggles is, is, and there's nothing wrong with that cause life is too short. We, we, we have our, we each have our own potential. We have amazing potential, and we can't let these inner struggles hold us back from enjoying life, enjoying our career, and enjoying everything.

Nirish Shakya: Yeah. Yeah, I can, I can definitely resonate with that in terms of, I think, it seems like all this work that we're doing, both with ourselves and also maybe with, external coaches, is to bring more neutrality into the voices. In our head. Cause a lot of times the voice, those voices are so biased in terms of the, the interpretation of the reality can be very skewed.

whether you're writing your morning pages in terms of creating that distance between you and your thoughts, or whether you're, engaging with a coach, you are trying to bring more neutrality into that voice.

Rizwan Javaid: Nice. Yeah, I think [00:37:00] that's a good way to look at it.

Thoughts and voice, inner inner voice for, for a long time and we it as truth and we think this is the way things are. But having that external voice to show that, They're not seeing the things that we're seeing. And to bring, like you said, neutrality to our thoughts so that we don't just take them for face value.

Nirish Shakya: Mm, absolutely. it reminds me of, one of the things that, Eckhart Toley says in his book, the Power of Now, where you know, everything that you are in is just a life situation. It's your mind that actually turns it into a problem. So it's not a problem until you label that as a problem.

Rizwan Javaid: That's a good point. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's the realization that I'm coming to now is when I have a problem, I realize, okay, it [00:38:00] maybe, it's probably just in my head because other people cannot hear my thoughts or see my thoughts, and so they're not seeing what I'm seeing. And Is what I'm thinking.

Valid. And,just from my experience yesterday with this social anxiety, I mean, I'm going to, I'm not gonna succeed every single time things are going to, break down. I'm not, I, I'm going fall into older habits, but in, in or in general, on the long run, things will get better as I focus on improving.

not being held back by those thoughts.

Nirish Shakya: Mm. Yeah. And then what role did your, upbringing have in, in how you thought about yourself?

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah, that's a, that's a great question. being from,a, a, Pakistani background and,like I. [00:39:00] My, my background has been, has definitely added to how I've, how I've, the challenges that I've had. I think it's more a lot of is cultural based where. you don't question, you don't, speak up, you don't, do certain things.

but in the Western culture, it's completely, it's a different, it's different where you, where, where you speak up and you share your thoughts, and so having that disconnect. Yeah, exactly. So I think that that added, cultural culture has a big, influence in how we show up as well. So there's definitely a lot of baggage from, from there that you kinda have to undo.

And it, it's also,family based as well, so how you were raised. so all those things add up. And understanding, understanding that part is important to, to help you overcome, those inner struggles.

Nirish Shakya: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I can [00:40:00] totally relate. Like I myself come from Anep police background. With, very similar, upbringing, I guess in terms of like compliance to rules, respect for authority and not, questioning that authority. I've had to unlearn a lot of those learnings and conditioning myself.

But it still exists. you still, that it's still in the back of the head in terms of Oh yeah. When someone says something to you, you shouldn't question that, or they're always right and you are wrong. so if, if, if someone is kind of going through those struggles, what is your number one advice that you'd give them to start to unlearn some of those, conditioning.

Rizwan Javaid: I think it's to look back at those experiences, those things that you've been told, and this is where journaling can really help, is to start listing those thi those things that you, you were made to believe are the truth. And to see are they valid? Are they, is [00:41:00] that what you see? What do you experience and is that how you wanna live?

And another, and another important thing is to understand what your values are as a person. And do those things that you, those messages that you were brought up with, do those align with your values as well? Is there a disconnect there? And so I think there's a lot inner work that also needs to happen in, in your journey so that you break free those all messages that may have helped previously but are not as useful now.

Nirish Shakya: How did you find out your values?

Rizwan Javaid: so I.

A values exercise. identifying, from a list of values and see what resonates with me. And so narrowing those down, living them, and seeing what shows up. as you go through the day, [00:42:00] identifying like the common ones that maybe there's like five or 10 values that really resonate with you and again, doing that work.

And it takes time to, to understand all of this. Cause as you're going through the day, you realize, okay, this is important for me. This isn't. And so you have to. To really understand yourself. So turning the lens on yourself, which was another, challenge, for me is I just never did turn the lens on myself.

It was always external. And seeing what other people think, instead of what, what I thought. And could definitely episode on.

Nirish Shakya: Absolutely. Absolutely. RIS one, Imagine it's your last day on earth and you are on your deathbed and someone comes up to you with a tiny piece of paper, let's say a small post-it and a Sharpie, and asks you to write your last words for humanity. What would you write on that tiny post-it.[00:43:00]

Rizwan Javaid: I would say it all begins with the mind. I think that that for me is will, that will unlock a lot of, challenges and help. overcome other challenges that you may face as well. So there's,it's, it's, it's a, it's a big topic, but I think it all begins with the mind. And if we can start to, work through that, understand it, experience it, and, come up with strategies to help with it.

And enjoy work and.

Nirish Shakya: Love that. Love that. I love how deep we've gone in such a short amount of time. and just to quickly recap our wonderful conversation there, I think one, my key takeaway from that was, How the world around you is your own mental construct. You have [00:44:00] constructed that world, and it might not be the actual reality, right?

So our quest as designers, as human beings is to constantly unlayer the truth, to really find out what is. Reality. cuz you know, there are, there's so many layers that have been built over that to, make you make sense of the world. Things like, oh, I'm not good enough. I'm not good at public speaking.

I'm not good at this and that I'm not good at sketching. But there are just external layers. They might not be the actual truth of who you really are. And I think what you've highlighted there for me is you have to be proactive in, Intentionally unlayering those layers and building a, a mental construct that actually works for you, that really aligns with who you really are and your values.

and you talked about different tools such as, for example, the morning pages, journaling. to externalize a lot of that [00:45:00] construct, that voice in a voice out, so that it can create that space between you and that voice and construct. And also, using, tools such as, working with the coach.

Who can bring that external voice to balance, balance it out. cause a lot of times, and we are so busy with what we do as designers, solving problems for our clients, creating outputs that we forget to shift that focus back onto ourselves. and we constantly are repeating these recurring patterns without re knowing why we're doing something, why we're feeling anxious.

but. sometimes there, there is a lot of value in stopping and looking at ourselves through this neutral lens and, and, and also the power of the mindset. we, we have the power to. reframe and shift our mindset from how we think about ourselves to how we would like to think about ourselves.

That actually is helpful and also brings us a lot [00:46:00] more peace and joy in the moment. Risan, thank you so much. it's been certainly very eyeopening for me. Very empowering. And thank you so much for again sharing your, Vulnerable stories and plus some of the tools that's work for you. and I'm sure like it's been really, really helpful for whoever's listening right now.

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah, I think that was beautifully put. Thank you so much for, inviting me and it was great to meet you, talk to you and share my story. I think this is,this is wonderful experience that you've created and, I'm really happy, happy, that we connected and you're similar.

I've also learned that, just to, to understand my own thoughts and, and I've, I've, I've learned a lot from just this experience with you. So thank you so much for, opening my eyes and, inviting me to your show. I've had a wonderful.

Nirish Shakya: [00:47:00] Amazing. Thank you very much. So, Rizwan, if people would like to get in touch with you or follow you or, maybe read up on any, any of your resources, that you've put out, how.

Rizwan Javaid: So the best thing would be to go to low Fidelity io. That is my, newsletter, where I write. And, you can also find the podcast there. the podcast is unleash Your Mindset, but the newsletter is where I currently write so you can. All about the different, topics that I discuss, mindfulness, mindset, and personal development.

And so yeah, that would be the best.

Nirish Shakya: Awesome, and I'll also share the link. To your, article on mindset that you've written, and you've kindly offered, a, a discount or you go offered it for free for design feeding listeners. if you click on the link in your, show notes on your podcasting app that you're listening to right now, you'll get straight.

Rizwan Javaid: To that paging and download, some really cool stuff that [00:48:00] RIS one has written on mine says, and how you can use them, in your, life as a designer. So Risan, thank you so much for joining me on Design Feeling. I'm sure there's good, there's so many more, conversations that we can have off the back of what we talked about, but we can probably leave that for later.

Nirish Shakya: well, and thank you so much and we'll you again soon.

Rizwan Javaid: Yeah. Thank you so.​

Nirish Shakya: Thank you so much for spending your time with us during this conversation. It means a lot to me and I really wanna make sure that this time is worthwhile to you. So please take a moment to think about one thing this conversation has helped you see differently. And if you'd like, you can also email it to me as well. I'd love to know what's useful and what's not so useful so that I can iterate future episodes for you. 

And don't forget about our exciting giveaway with the UX conf. If you haven't already, subscribe to this podcast and send me an email saying you've subscribed and you wanna win a ticket to [00:49:00] nirish@designfeeling.co. And you could win a free remote ticket to the conference worth 114 pounds. And do it before Wednesday, the 9th of August. 'cause we'll be announcing the winner on Thursday the 10th of August.

Until next time, keep exploring and keep growing. But remember to take the time for recovery and reflection. I'm Nirish Shakya, and this has been The Design Feeling Podcast. See you next time.